This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity. See the full interview below.
Handep is a social enterprise in the heart of Indonesian Borneo, where we help reconnect our friends and family with their lands and forests for a more sustainable living. We work to empower indigenous women and farmers through sustainable fashion and agricultural products.
Randi is the Founder & CEO of Handep, a social enterprise that works to empower women and farmers in Kalimantan through sustainable fashion, and agricultural products. Randi is an avid environmentalist and community development practitioner with extensive experience working with various NGOs including the Heart of Borneo Project (HoBP), International Labour Organization (ILO), and The Forest Trust. He obtained his Master’s degree in Environment and Development Study at the University of Melbourne, Australia in 2018.
He is also a social scientist whose research focuses on political economy, Indigenous people and gender issues within the development sphere. His interests include sustainability, genders, social justice, Indigenous rights and community development. Through Handep, Randi strives to improve the local economy, especially for rural and forest-dependent communities in Indonesian Borneo, and preserve the rainforests, not only for the biodiversity value, but for every living being who depends on forests.
This interview was recorded on September 16, 2020.
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Fiona Martin (FM):
Hi Randi. Thank you for joining us all the way from Jakarta, Indonesia. I'm super excited to interview you for The Eco-Interviews. Let's get started - can you introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about what you're doing?
Randi:
Hi everybody. My name is Randi Julian Miranda, you can call me Randi. I'm the Founder and CEO of Handep, which is a social enterprise based in Indonesian Borneo, precisely in Central Kalimantan. We work to empower our indigenous people, especially the women through more sustainable livelihoods such as sustainable fashion and agricultural products. That's pretty much what I've been doing in the past three years and prior to that I actually worked for a number of different international organizations focusing on sustainability especially within the forest governance.
FM:
Excellent. Can you tell us a little bit about your personal background? You mentioned that you're a social scientist, and then what drove you to start Handep with these women and the indigenous people in that region?
Randi:
Well, I think it's really personal to me. I was born and grew up in a very remote village in Central Borneo, where my family was basically a traditional farmer and also gold miner. My childhood was really close to nature where I used to go to the forest, foraging for fruits, vegetables, and some time I went hunting with my dad or with my grandfather. Then I also spent a lot time on our rice field. As a diet, my childhood especially was very, very connected to nature. But then as I grew up, things started to change where I witnessed a lot of massive extractive industry development taking place on our land. But unfortunately, this kind of massive development is affecting our indigenous people, my people from our own lands.
And we are often only left with environmental destruction, like the loss of the forest, the extinctions of the animals and also our right to lands and forests are being deprived by these big corporations. So I was thinking, what was going on? But as someone who was living and studying in such a remote village, I didn't understand the complexity of the issues. Long story short, I spent six years working with several international organizations after I completed my bachelor degree back in 2012. And I learned a lot of different things around sustainability issues especially in regards to the rights of indigenous people. Then I started to understand gradually what was going on, on our land and I decided to deepen my knowledge, to harness my understanding on how things actually work on our land, in our place.
Then, I did my Masters at the University of Melbourne, Australia in 2017. And after that through a lot of reflection, I decided to come back to my home village to actually start doing something with our community. Because at that moment, I wasn't sure if I had to continue my career with these big international organizations, because a lot of lessons learned that most of the projects are very short term. Two or three years and then they're gone after the donors' funding is done. They're also gone and our people just have no idea how to carry on with the projects after they left our community. So I was thinking how can I start something that is local, that aligns with our traditions and cultures and also of course long term, not only one or two years and then I'm gone.
So, I went on a study, on a survey to a number of villages, especially my home village and collectively with my people started to identify what can be developed as an alternative sources of livelihood or incomes for us. That can be done by locals and also can benefit the locals, but in a sustainable way that doesn't harm the environment. Especially doesn't damage the forest because it's our source of livelihoods. Long story short, we came up with a few options that we can begin with in sustainable fashion, like the bags and hats that we have been producing since 2018 is the first priority that our people choose to work on. And Handep ever since has been focusing on sustainable fashion. And we, I think five months ago, just started developing some organic agricultural products.
So it's basically based on my own journey, and collective voice and interests of our people. But then through my leadership, I try to do what I can to support my community in order to get the rights that they're supposed to deserve.
FM:
That's amazing Randi. What an amazing story from you, coming from a village and trying to find something that's going to work long-term for the village to sustain the indigenous crafts, and help the livelihood of the people. As we are in an ever evolving world, and modernization moves into different areas, it sounds like you're adapting. And I think it's very commendable as well that you surveyed the people in the villages to ask them what they wanted to come to market with. Because I think it's easy ... Well first of all, you're not an outsider. So you have that compassion with your people, but I think it's too easy for outsiders to come in and dictate to a community what they should be selling. So can you highlight these indigenous crafts for us, tell us about these wonderful baskets and hats. And then you said you're moving into agriculture as well.
Randi:
Well, here we go. If we look at the socio-economic landscapes of indigenous people across Southeast Asia, especially in Indonesia, the major or main livelihoods of our people are two - traditional agriculture and handcrafts. Especially for women, handcrafts play a very significant role to support their livelihoods. And millions of people actually depends on crafts not only to survive, but also to get better quality of life in our ever changing world and economic landscape. And in Central Borneo itself a lot of villages actually depend on crafts, and organic or traditional farming for their sources of livelihoods.
Then the people that I work with, around 200 community members that are part of our initiative since late 2018, are all depending on craft. The men are doing the harvests of rattan in the forest. Rattan is a type of natural fiber that grows in the forest. It's actually a very sustainable type of palm that can only grow in the forests and a very durable material that is often used for furniture, baskets and also fashion crafts. Maybe I want to show you one of our designs, our signature design is this one. This is the back, very beautiful, very intricate, I believe this is very unique to my indigenous community here in Central Borneo. So they depend on craft. These five villages that we are now working with depend on craft not only for their day to day basic survival but also to send their children to school, to get better education.
And directly crafting using rattan also contributes to forest preservation because as I mentioned earlier, it can only grow in the forest. So for them if they want to have the rattan as raw materials in the long run, then they need to preserve their forests. So not only that it is supporting the local economy of the indigenous community here, but it also contributes to natural climate change solutions.
FM:
Right, so you can't cultivate rattan...
Randi:
It cannot be grown as a monoculture, it has to grow in the forests. Its growth is by creeping over the tall trees to get the sunlight.
FM:
Oh, wow. I'll have to find a photo of that somewhere and add that, that's very unique. So, the fashion industry has a bad reputation when it comes to the environment. What difficulties have you faced in bringing a sustainable and eco-centric fashion brand to market?
Randi:
I think first and foremost is to slowly change the mindset of the customers, of the people who are buying the products because they're very used to cheap products that are massively produced, mass production. And they can get away with it at a really low price. Well, sometimes they're not really cheap anyway, but with more and more clothing or fashion brands doing mass production, it has become a lot more affordable. Of course, our market is very, very segmented only to people who already have the foundational knowledge or understanding of sustainability. And how fashion industry especially has such adverse impacts on the environment, also the people who get involved in the supply chain.
So trying to educate people about our values, our process, our supply chains, is very, very difficult even until now it's still our big, big task to actually have that under better understanding for people. But we're slowly getting there by creating more interactive content, like videos, posters, photos, to give some sort of information about what we do so people have a better understanding. So, in doing our work, we're not only selling the products, but we're also at the same time educating people about the impacts of fast fashion, how bad it is socially and also ecologically. I think that's one of the biggest challenges and second of all, I think it's also trying to educate people about fair trade, yeah. About fair trade.
Because sometimes people undervalue sustainable products like handcraft products, handmade products. It's more often than not under appreciated and under valued by the people because they think that because it's handmade then it is supposed to be cheap, especially here in Asia. We have kind of a reverse mindset compared to a lot of people in Europe or in the Unite States that value and handcraft products or handmade products more than mass produced product. So we sort of are facing a challenge on how to reverse the narrative of our handmade products like this. But we have done some really, really significant efforts on trying to explain the process behind every product, from upstream to downstream. So people have a better understanding on how complex the process is, on how eco-friendly it is, on how impactful we are socially and environmentally in doing our business.
FM:
That's commendable. Can you describe who that Handep girl is? Who is your ideal customer?
Randi:
Mostly people who embrace sustainability principles in their life or are into handmade products. And in terms of incomes, if we talk about demographics, it's at the moment unfortunately, mostly middle to upper class. Well, it doesn't mean that we do not want to engage people at the lower bottom of the economy, but because in terms of price we do not want to do the same mistake like big, big brands do with their products pricing.
FM:
So, it sounds like you lead with the sustainability aspect. That is certainly a value add to your product. Do you experience any backlash from leading with the sustainability aspect or are people very open to this?
Randi:
The answer is, yes and no. Here is the problem. People often think that a lot of brands are using the word sustainability only as a branding and marketing strategy. So there is the notion that sustainability is often only a form of green washing. And that's one of our biggest challenges in communicating our value to our customers or potential customers. But it's also easy at the moment we become very transparent with our business process. So for instance, we are very open and transparent about our pricing formula, where all the money goes. Like what percentage of the total price of each product, goes to the weavers, goes to the tailors, goes to the additional materials and packaging.
What percentage goes to operational cost and what percentage of profit margin we are taking. We're being very open with that component. So, if you for instance are buying one of our products then it will come with a pack that explains everything about our social enterprise, about the women or the weavers behind the product that makes the products. And we also explain about the pricing components in the product tags so people have a better understanding. But we're slowly educating more and more people here, especially in Indonesia, to be aware of where their money actually goes to, and what impacts their money can actually make. It's either positive or negative, and we're trying to convince them that every penny that they spend on our products actually goes to make good impacts.
FM:
Yeah, and it's staying within your community as well. I imagine that's something to highlight that the money isn't going abroad, that is staying within in Indonesia, right?
Randi:
Yeah.
FM:
Yeah. Do you sell only in Indonesia? What is your market right now?
Randi:
Well, we mostly sell here domestically in Indonesia, but we also have started doing worldwide shipping. It's mostly retail. Basically, Handep focuses more on B2C retail, 80% we do retail. We have done shipments to a lot of countries, but in a very small quantity, just one or two pieces. Europe, US, Australia and other neighboring Asian countries. We just started that actually in late 2019. But we really focus more on domestic market because we're being very careful with our carbon footprint and stuff like that.
FM:
That was exactly what I was going to ask you is, I certainly have an interest in buying from handcrafts instead of fast fashion, but I'm always concerned a lot all of these handcrafts do come from overseas. Unfortunately, United States we've very much decimated our indigenous handcrafts which is not great. But as someone ... Because this is leading with sustainability and the environment. How are you tackling, if your international market grows, the emissions involved in international shipping?
Randi:
So, what we do we carbon offset, I would say yes, sort of carbon offset mechanism. Oh my god, I've forgotten a lot of things that I studied during my Masters. Every purchase plants one tree. Like I mentioned earlier, all these raw materials, these rattans are sourced from the forest and they can only grow in the forest. But there are a lot of forests that have been degraded because of palm oil mostly, logging companies and also mining companies and they're just left like that, degraded or damaged. So what we do at Handep is that we plant one tree for every purchase of one bag. So it comes with a certificate like this, and then it says here, I'm not sure if you can see it clearly, "One bag, one tree."
It's also our effort to reduce our carbon emission, because when we do international shipping, we are very aware that it takes a significant amount of fossil fuel. So we try to offset that by planting tree. And not only that, we also are using 20% of our profit to actually support a lot of social or community development programs here, including supporting the indigenous communities getting their rights to their own forests. Here in Indonesia, we are starting to support one of the communities that we work with to get their legal paper for the ownership of their own customary forest, because it has not been legally recognized by the state. So it's one of the efforts that we are doing through the profit that we are making through the business.
FM:
That's excellent. And are you doing anything special with your packaging? Like reducing the packaging or using sustainable packaging?
Randi:
Yes, we are. I'm going to show you this. Usually we offer our customers two options - if they want to use used boxes or they want to use our boxes made of recycled paper. Also, for the inside we actually use the waste from the rattan is organic waste. Everything is ... Well I can tell 80% is sustainable, made up of naturally biodegradable materials. So, if they want to use this one, then we will use this but if they just want to use old box from ... We collect, how do you say that? Used boxes from stores nearby because they usually just chuck it out into the trash bin. We use it as a packaging box. We have that options for our customers.
Also, we always inform them that we are offsetting our carbon by planting one tree in every communication materials with the customers.
FM:
I love it. It looks like I can put that extra rattan and the cardboard in my composting pile and then it can feed my garden and it's full circular.
Randi:
Yeah.
FM:
So what do you see for the future of Handep? You're doing handcrafts now, you briefly mentioned the traditional agriculture. Can you talk about that in any other ideas coming down the line?
Randi:
This is the organic rice and this is the jungle honey. Yes, so we with the organic rice. This is our new project. So you know Asians eat a lot of rice, especially Indonesians. It's like our main staple here. But the thing is, it's being done in a very, very unsustainable way and in a very massive scale. But what's interesting about traditional agriculture here is they don't use chemical fertilizers, they don't use pesticides. They use it in a very traditional way.
They only use organic fertilizers by using leaves and wood, stuff like that, that they collect from the forests. And we started to promote this product as an alternative for regular rice and actually the demand is quite good for this kind of rice. Because more and more people in Indonesia, actually around 10% of the population are transitioning to a healthier lifestyle by only consuming organic products. So, that's a good move.
As for the fashion products, we see that we are aiming to be one of the leading sustainable fashion brands, not only in Asia but also globally because I personally believe that traditional handcraft should be the new luxury. You know what I'm saying? Because it's made through a very long and intricate process. Almost zero use of fossil fuel. Unless the moment you ship it overseas, and it's made with love and care. And interestingly, rattan can last for more than 20 years.
It can last for more than 20 years. Not any less durable than genuine leather. As long as you know how to take care of it, it can last very, very long.
FM:
Wonderful. How do you harvest the forest honey?
Randi:
Oh, they actually harvest it only once or twice a year during the tropical fruit season. So there will be a lot of honeybees making their hives in the tall trees in the forest because they get the flowers, the fruit flowers, and that's the moment they usually harvest it. So how we work with the honey foragers is they basically supply the raw honey to us, and then we do all the packaging for them. And it's kind of seasonal products because they don't produce a lot of jungle honey.
FM:
Yeah. So they don't set up hives everywhere. They're actually foraging in the forest?
Randi:
They're foraging in the forest.
FM:
That's amazing. I bet it's delicious. I can't imagine what that tastes like.
Randi:
It is. Yeah.
FM:
Do these products have more health benefits? I imagine like foraged honey and also organically produced rice through traditional agriculture must have a higher nutritional benefit than something that's produced chemically.
Randi:
Yes. Especially for the organic rice, they smell much, much better than the rice that is grown conventionally because the Dayak people only grow the rice once a year, because they only rely on the rain for their irrigation system. So it's only once a year and it's on a highland. Yeah. So the taste is different. The texture is also different. And usually this kind of rice is considered very, very one of a kind. Because they don't actually grow the rice for commercial proposes. Rather they grow it for their own food so kind of self sufficient, it's for their self sufficient needs. And only the surplus of the harvest will be sold. So they're not actually that very, very capitalistic like us in the city or in urban areas. They're more conscious about their own consumption and they see it as their own responsibility and especially with the villages that are working with us. It's still compulsory for each household to have their own rice field. So they usually stock it up for the entire year because they only do the farming once a year.
FM:
Amazing. So why do we need more ethical fashion companies like Handep and businesses that are tapping into these traditional product making skills?
Randi:
I think first and foremost ethical fashions is beyond just about moneymaking. It has more values than just profit generation, but it also usually champions for cultural preservation, community empowerment, social justice. There are so many values that ethical fashion actually embodies. And I think it's really important to support this noble coast not only for the sake of our physical appearance, but also the beauty deep down there. And especially with ethical fashion, I think why it's becoming more and more important in the 21st century because a lot of ethical fashions are trying to, how would I say that? Trying to preserve what is already gone and it doesn't promote over-consumerism. Like you can observe with fast fashion in general. Every season they always change the designs, they always encourage people to buy. They always make people feel bad if their clothes or their bags or their hats are no longer in trend. Ethical fashions is promoting more timeless fashion that fashion shouldn't be only about style, but it should be about your identity, your identity as individual.
FM:
I love that. I think you're tapping into something that I hope grows globally, which is to get out of this consumer cycle that we've been brought into. Like you said, fast fashion not only has so many seasons, but the clothes and the items are made so poorly that even if you did love that top, you can't wear it longer than a year, because it's going to fall apart. And so to buy beautiful handcrafted items that are made with love, that are durable, that are timeless, is a noble thing to do. And I think for me, at least it brings me joy as well to understand that someone's hands have crafted this and you feel that. So, man, I would love to be able to get something from Handep myself. So in saying that, how do people connect with Handep? How would you like us to find you online or elsewhere?
Randi:
Yeah, it would be really great if you get one of our collections and if you guys want to find out more about us and want to keep in touch, you can follow us on our social media platforms, like on our Instagram. You can just type Handep and then it will pop up on your search and you can also visit our website, www.handep.com. And go to our YouTube channel if you want to watch our documentary video, it explains a lot of things about why we started Handep and what we actually do and how we do what we are doing. Every information is there. And I'm happy to answer your questions about what we do because we are obliged to do so. We are obliged to communicate whatever we can to our customers, or simply public out there. And I think it's not always easy for an initiative like ours, especially in a developing countries and in a very, very remote area here in Indonesia to be recognized by wider audience. So I really hope that we can connect. You guys can find out more about what we do here.
FM:
Yes, I'm going to definitely share all those links. And Handep is spelled H-A-N-D-E-P for anyone who's just listening along on the podcast. We will link to all the social media and the website in the show notes, and we'll make sure to link to them on our social media as well. Randi, this has been a wonderful interview with you. Is there anything, any other thoughts that you would like to leave us with or anything you want to tell our audience?
Randi:
Yeah. Maybe I didn't mention this in the beginning that Borneo Island, where we are, where I am now is the third largest Island in the world. And it is home to the second largest remaining rainforest in the world after Amazon. So it plays a very critical role, not only for people here in Indonesia, but also globally because it serves as the lung of the world. So what we do really matters. It's not only about fashion items like this, but it's a lot bigger than that. It's about keeping the dignity and the rights of our indigenous people. It's also about supporting the forest preservations for our future generations, not only here, but also globally because climate change or global warming have no boundary. So everyone of us is definitely impacted by climate change.
So your support will mean a lot to us because it is about our collective future. And one more thing, this is to send from me as a social planner or as a fashion entrepreneur that we need to look beyond just financial gain in doing business. We also need to take into account the impacts that we create to our people and also to our environment. And remember, by the end of the day, you don't die with your money, but you die with your legacy and people will remember you with that.
FM:
I love that, Randi. Thank you. Actually, before we close out, tell us, you said, that Borneo is the third largest island in the world and it's home to the second largest rainforest. Tell us again, or tell us a little bit more about what is threatening the rainforest in particular in Borneo.
Randi:
Now with the complex political economy here in Indonesia, it's not only domestic investment, but also foreign investment are taking over our lands and forest. A lot of gold and coal mining and oil and also logging companies are massively and rampantly degrading our forest. But remember that those forests are not only home to the orangutan or to the exotic animals, but it's also home to thousands and even millions of indigenous people whose livelihoods are dependent on the forest resources. So this is actually a very, very urgent issue that we are trying to tackle. But because we are very remote and often under reported by the mainstream media, we don't have a lot of platforms to share about the issues that are threatening one of the oldest rainforests in the world here.
FM:
We certainly want to highlight that. And something you mentioned briefly, but I'm interested in is, because we're having the same issue actually here, even in South Carolina, is land ownership in that the indigenous people's rights to the land is not being recognized. So these forests are seen as being not owned by anyone, which is land ownership is a modern concept that just doesn't translate everywhere, right? So how is the community fighting to protect land that in a legal, on-paper sense might not have their name on it?
Randi:
The indigenous communities here across Indonesia are struggling to get the rights of their own lands and forest. Although the government has this initiative to recognize and give legal recognition on paper to indigenous people, but it has been poorly done. It has been, how would I say that? Distracted by economic interests of huge investments and also most indigenous communities here don't have the technical capacity to get the legal papers from the state. And in Indonesia, almost all the land and forests are owned by the state. So even though the existence of indigenous communities have long been there even prior to the establishments of Indonesia as a country, but the thing is in order for them to be recognized as an indigenous community or as a customary community still needs legal paper from the government.
Randi:
So it's kind of, how would I say that? It's such a paradox here in Indonesia, because you cannot claim your customary forest because you don't have the little paper, but in order to be acknowledged or recognized as an indigenous people or customary people. Customary people is the term that we use here in Indonesia for indigenous people, but you also need the legal paper from the government to acknowledge as an indigenous community. So it's really weird and it shows a very complex political economy of land control in Indonesia, where the government is very, very how would I say that? Reluctant to give the lands and forest that actually belong to the indigenous people that have been there for ages. So it's very complex and that's what I actually am going through at the moment, supporting one of indigenous communities to get the legal paper of their customary forest.
And the process has been so difficult and going through complex bureaucracy. And the thing is, we don't have one uniform or one nationally agreed map of land use plan in Indonesia. So the governments of different levels have their own maps to refer to. So it makes it even more complex. But one same narrative is that all the government, at all levels are very supportive of extractive industry that makes the life and the struggles of indigenous people even a lot more difficult.
FM:
It must be incredibly frustrating to have to prove to some legal entity that you exist and you have rights.
Randi:
I know right? For instance, like you as a human and you need to be acknowledged by the government as a human, it's so weird. Why you need that kind of legal acknowledgements of your identity as an individual or as a community.
FM:
Yeah. To me, it's just a proof that colonialism is still coming in and causing problems. There's recently in the U.S been a very big backlash talking about colonial settlers and stuff and the impacts. And not only do we need to fight the ill effects of what our ancestors did hundreds of years ago, we need to be helping those communities that are facing it right here and right now. And it sounds like Borneo is one of those communities that need to get a wider audience to understand what's going on so that we can support somehow. And just with climate change and everything's going on, it still surprises me that as a human race, we move forward with these extractive industries. But when the profit motive is so strong, it's very hard to kick people of that habit.
Randi:
Yeah, it's really depressing honestly, and I have been through depression as well, especially this year, because there are so many land disputes over forest areas between indigenous communities and extractive companies here in Borneo. Being part of that movement to support our people has never been easy. And I don't know, it's been very difficult when we look at the bigger picture of the social economic system that we're living today. I think this is so wrong at so many levels. And I just don't understand why a small group of people are so, so greedy, and do not look at the impacts that they cause on others and the environment. It's so devastating.
FM:
Yeah. Are there any organizations or groups that are fighting this, that you would like to direct us to? Or do you have that information on the website?
Randi:
We do. We have that Indigenous Alliance here, the local one, and also the national ones. And we also have some other grassroots organizations that work or champions for the rights of indigenous people. Of course, I can connect you to them if you want to find out more information, because they're all actually we've been working together on the same issue. Especially this year, all this different organization that share the same vision are united because the issues that we are facing now have been much more complex and bigger than ever. So we're trying to create that joint force in order to accelerate the process of the conflict resolutions.
FM:
Yes, I'd love to connect with those organizations and we can promote them as well so that people can follow and support in whatever way makes the most sense for those organizations.
Randi:
Yeah.
FM:
Well Randi, I really appreciate you spending the time with us. We've managed to make it work across incredible time zones from Indonesia, all the way to the East Coast of the United States. And so to be in your presence, even digitally has been a complete joy. I look forward to sharing Handep with our audience, and making people aware of what the indigenous people of Borneo are facing so that we can do our best to try and change the tides.
Randi:
Thank you so much Fiona. It's been a pleasure sharing about what we do with you, and also speaking about the issues that we are dealing with here in Borneo. Thank you so much for having me.
FM:
Thank you. Thank you Handep. I mean, excuse me, thank you, Randi from Handep. So thank you.
Randi:
Thank you.